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The Oldest Profession
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Nigel



Joined: 02 Nov 2013
Posts: 56
Location: A Beach Somewhere

PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 1:02 pm    Post subject: The Oldest Profession  Reply with quote

Could someone point where in the constitution, the government has the right to make prostitution illegal?

From where is this authority to regulate a victimless transaction between two people behind closed doors derived?
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bieramar



Joined: 19 Nov 2010
Posts: 4441
Location: Taylor Ranch, NM

PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 2:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

First, prostitution as defined as a "victimless transaction between two consenting adults behind closed doors," is not illegal under federal law and/or the U.S. Constitution. Prostitution is legal in a number of counties in Nevada - local option under the Nevada Constitution.

However certain types of prostitution, and commercial sex trafficking, are illegal under federal law; specifically the Mann Act.

Both the prescription in Nevada and the federal proscriptions are derived out of the Constitution paragraphs
"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people," or
"Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction," or
"to regulate Commerce with foreign Nations, and among several States, and with the Indian Tribes."

Basically transporting any person across a state line or pueblo/reservation boundary for "any sexual activity for which any person can be charged with a criminal offense" (Pub. L. No. 99-628, 100 Stat. 35113512.) is a federal crime.

Which thus focuses your question on state and local laws which make prostitution illegal within the respective jurisdictions, and thus subject to the federal Mann Act.

I'm thinking about that, and will be back.
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coebul



Joined: 18 Nov 2010
Posts: 3285
Location: Northwest USA

PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 4:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Adding to bieramar's points I would add.   The Constitution is the rule book by which the government works.  Not a set of laws to live by...  It sets up the powers and authority of the various parts of government...  The three bodies....  Legislative, executive, Judicial, the States, the Amendment process.....  The Bill of rights came after the Constitution was ratified...  But the X Amendment state quite clearly:

"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people. "

And we have been fighting over this Amendment since 1791.
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bieramar



Joined: 19 Nov 2010
Posts: 4441
Location: Taylor Ranch, NM

PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 5:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's a good summary of the late 19th and early 20th century rationales and state laws which made prostitution illegal: http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-...cinating-history-sex-work-america
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Nigel



Joined: 02 Nov 2013
Posts: 56
Location: A Beach Somewhere

PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 7:10 pm    Post subject: BOR Reply with quote

How does one reconcile prostitution arrests with the bill of rights?
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coebul



Joined: 18 Nov 2010
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Location: Northwest USA

PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 8:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are you serious?  Have you read them?
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Nigel



Joined: 02 Nov 2013
Posts: 56
Location: A Beach Somewhere

PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 8:18 pm    Post subject: Why Yes I Have Reply with quote

Have you?

"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue"

"right of the people to be secure in their persons"

How is a woman's body doe snot fall under "secure in their persons"?  Her sexual proclivity and her consort's generosity is non of the government's business.  

Who exactly is the injured? The victim?
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bieramar



Joined: 19 Nov 2010
Posts: 4441
Location: Taylor Ranch, NM

PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 8:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Phrased another way, why haven't the state anti-prostitution laws, passed under the states rights provision of the Tenth Amendment, been overturned as unconstitutional under the 4th, 5th, 9th, and 14th Amendments?

I don't know, and having been an advocate and activist for personal rights since the sixties - seeing state laws banning miscegenation, contraception, sodomy, and cunnilingus in the private setting declared unconstitutional in the last fifty years - I'm surprised.

The following is excerpted from Lawrence et al vs. Texas:

[Begin] Our prior cases make two propositions abundantly clear. First, the fact that the governing majority in a State has traditionally viewed a particular practice as immoral is not a sufficient reason for upholding a law prohibiting the practice; Second, individual decisions by married persons, concerning the intimacies of their physical relationship, even when not intended to produce offspring, are a form of "liberty" protected by the Due Process Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment. Moreover, this protection extends to intimate choices by unmarried as well as married persons." 478 U. S., at 216 (footnotes and citations omitted).

The present case does not involve minors. It does not involve persons who might be injured or coerced or who are situated in relationships where consent might not easily be refused. It does not involve public conduct or prostitution.[End]

SCOTUS still holds prostitution as an exception!

I'm still thinking.
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coebul



Joined: 18 Nov 2010
Posts: 3285
Location: Northwest USA

PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 8:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bieramar he isn't talking about states.  He believe (I think) the IV amendment provides for prostitution!  

What ever!  A silly idea not worthy of discussion.

I'm out! (Shark Tank).
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Nigel



Joined: 02 Nov 2013
Posts: 56
Location: A Beach Somewhere

PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 10:25 pm    Post subject: The Providers Reply with quote

It doesn't provide for it.  The amendments don't provide for things. They delineate inalienable rights.

As such, the state or federal government has no standing telling two consent adults what they can or cannot do in private with their own bodies.

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