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Libya
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Should the U.S. participate in military actions in Libya?
(A) Only if UN Security Council authorizes.
12%
 12%  [ 1 ]
(B) Only if Arab League members support.
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
(C) Only if US Congress approves.
12%
 12%  [ 1 ]
(D) By Presidential Executive Order.
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
All of the above (A - D)
37%
 37%  [ 3 ]
No.
25%
 25%  [ 2 ]
Other; see comments below.
12%
 12%  [ 1 ]
Total Votes : 8

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bieramar



Joined: 19 Nov 2010
Posts: 4441
Location: Taylor Ranch, NM

PostPosted: Sat Mar 12, 2011 7:34 pm    Post subject: Libya  Reply with quote

Libya: Arab League calls for United Nations no-fly zone - The Arab League called on the United Nations Security Council to impose a no-fly zone on Libya, increasing pressure on Europe and the US to embark on limited military action against the regime of Colonel Muammar Gaddafi. By Colin Freeman in Cairo, Nick Meo in Benghazi and Patrick Hennessy in London [M]inisters from the 22-nation [Arab] League agreed to call for action after emergency talks in Cairo. Officials said the body had already been in touch with the rebels about the situation on the ground. Before the meeting, Amr Moussa, the secretary general of the Arab League and one of its most influential diplomats, had thrown his weight behind the air exclusion zone, saying it was the only way to protect Libyans from Gaddafi's "disdainful" regime. In a statement after a six-hour long meeting, he added: "The Arab League has officially requested the United Nations Security Council to impose a no-fly zone against any military action against the Libyan people." "I do not know who will impose this zone, nor how, that remains to be seen," he said, in an interview with Germany's Der Spiegel magazine. "I am talking about a humanitarian action. It consists, with a no-fly zone, of supporting the Libyan people in their fight for freedom against a regime that is more and more disdainful." Arab backing for an international no-fly zone is considered essential by Britain and France, which are battling to overcome fears in America and among other European Union members that its imposition would be portrayed by Gaddafi as Western military meddling in Libyan affairs. In an interview with The Sunday Telegraph William Hague, the [British] Foreign Secretary, said: "You need a legal base for any military action, and I am counting a no-fly zone as military action, and you need support within the region from the Arab world. "Clearly if we are to have a no-fly zone we would like Arab nations to participate in it militarily." [United States Sec'y of Defense Gates and the European Union (EU) summit meeting this week stated essentially the same thing]. Mr Hague also said Gaddafi was becoming a pariah among his fellow Arabs. He added: "Even if he regained control over part of the country, the Arab world want to have nothing to do with him any more." As a further gesture to distance itself from Gaddafi's regime, the League yesterday refused to allow two envoys from Gaddafi's regime to attend. Instead, it heard from representatives from the self-declared provisional government in eastern Libya, who asked them to back the no-fly zone and also give them official recognition as a legitimate authority. Prior to the meeting, Iraq had already expressed "clear and firm" support, as had the six-nation Gulf Cooperation Council. But other important regional players - notably Saudi Arabia, Syria and Algeria - had been more cautious, insisting only on the need for "Arab consensus". --- end excerpts --- Source: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/w...r-United-Nations-no-fly-zone.html === Another good step in getting back on track in Middle East foreign policy, reminiscent of one part of the Eisenhower doctrine of the mid-50s, and retreating from the neo-conservative U.S.-led preemptive foreign wars conjured up as "national defense" which alienated many prospective Muslim and Arab allies and precipitated others into fanatic anti-West beliefs and behaviours. That a majority of the 22 Arab League nations support this action - even as half of the nations are dealing with their own insurgencies demanding more political and economic freedom - is indicative of their common goal to diminish or destroy ?al Qaeda's rapidly decreasing influence in the region.
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bieramar



Joined: 19 Nov 2010
Posts: 4441
Location: Taylor Ranch, NM

PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2011 8:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My apologies - I thought I was setting the poll up so we could choose multiple responses, but it didn't turn out that way.

Anyway I say U.S. military action only if the UNSC, the Arab League, and the U.S. Congress approve.
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Guido Sarducci



Joined: 18 Nov 2010
Posts: 25

PostPosted: Mon Mar 14, 2011 4:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That any where close to how you want it?
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bieramar



Joined: 19 Nov 2010
Posts: 4441
Location: Taylor Ranch, NM

PostPosted: Mon Mar 14, 2011 11:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What I want(ed) was the "multiple choices" option as listed on the format menu, but as I've long since learned from the Stones "You can't always get what you want."

I suspect its an almost moot question anyway; plus one can always addend a comment.
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bieramar



Joined: 19 Nov 2010
Posts: 4441
Location: Taylor Ranch, NM

PostPosted: Mon Mar 14, 2011 4:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think a coalition military action approved by the parties (like the First Gulf War) would justify our military involvement, but not our leadership.

I think the a country selected by the Arab League and/or by the European Union and/or by an ad hoc coalition of regional nations should be the lead nation, NOT the U.S.

We would be a participant only, under the UNSC and NATO authorizaions/legacy, preferably providing intel only, and only possibly using UAVs for non-human targets.
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coebul



Joined: 18 Nov 2010
Posts: 3285
Location: Northwest USA

PostPosted: Mon Mar 14, 2011 9:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As to the reality of what is happening in the ME specifically Africa for the moment.  This is a culmination of piss poor foreign policy and energy policy of the last 4 maybe 5 Presidents.  

Personally I would tell the last one to leave to flip off the lights and let them finger out what they want to do.  Either join the 21st century and the human race or go ahead and live in your petty kingdoms.  

But we have to have that oil.

This President has failed to lead us in that we still import 60% of our oil.  That with the resources we have is ridicules.  During the campaign season 0bama said he would slowly force energy prices high enough to make green energy affordable (paraphrase).  Well he is getting his wish.  Gas at the pump in my area is $3.97 a gallon for high test.  That is up $.10 from Friday.  

All the Green energy in the world will fix the problem and until we (the nation) ween ourselves off the ME tit.   More then 30% of our imported oil comes from people that hate us.  

The tragedy or the Japanese earthquake and tsunami could/will force another boost in prices at the pump.
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puc reducks



Joined: 21 Nov 2010
Posts: 1250

PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2011 2:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apparently, the French wish to topple Gahdafi/Khadaffy.

The FRENCH!!!   Rolling Eyes
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bieramar



Joined: 19 Nov 2010
Posts: 4441
Location: Taylor Ranch, NM

PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2011 3:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

puc reducks wrote:
Apparently, the French wish to topple Gahdafi/Khadaffy.

The FRENCH!!!   Rolling Eyes


The Canonical List of French Jokes (on a WWII aircraft website!): http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/...nical-list-french-jokes-9613.html

And they did rule and colonize much of north Africa for years.

I've always been a bit mystified by the French Joke phenomena, beginning with listening to my dad, a WWI veteran, and his peers telling "frog" jokes, and then turning serious with tales of the bravery of French Foreign Legionnaires, and drunkenly singing verse after verse of "How ya goin' to keep 'em down on the farm, after they've seen Paree" -- seemingly a love/hate emotion.  That my mom's grandparents had emigrated from Alsace-Lorraine after the Germans took possession from the French only added to the dissonance.

Then in WWII, when dad was based in Casablanca, French Morocco, riding dispatch motorcyles/trucks through French-occupied Algeria, Tunisia and the Barbary Coast (present day Libya), with DeGaulle's Free French patriots and paratroopers the elite of the fighting forces, and the French underground the heroes of the Resistance in Europe, the only "frog" jokes I heard were from civilian  older German-speaking farmers in Iowa, and usually aimed at the Vichy French.

But when I was home-based in French Morocco in 1955, most of us (U.S. military and civilian federal employees) were back making fun of the French, and rooting for the Moroccans in their struggle for independence from France.

Then they fought alongside the British and Israelis in 1956 when the 3 country coalition invaded Egypt. Yet the French Jokes kept on coming.

Of course after they refused to join Bush's invasion of Iraq eight years ago, the "cowardly" jokes multiplied.
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bieramar



Joined: 19 Nov 2010
Posts: 4441
Location: Taylor Ranch, NM

PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2011 2:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LinkTV and FreeSpeechTV (satellite channels 9410 and 9415 on DishTV) are regularly preempting their regular programming and broadcasting AljazeeraTV which is streaming live from several sites in Libya, covering the major Gaddafi-ordered offensives against the revolutionaries.  Also Aljazeera is streaming live video from its English language website.

Gaddafi has rejected the UN Security Council Resolution; and yesterday's announcement of a ceasefire was a feint, and broadcast only outside of Libya.


Last edited by bieramar on Sat Mar 19, 2011 2:53 pm; edited 1 time in total
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bieramar



Joined: 19 Nov 2010
Posts: 4441
Location: Taylor Ranch, NM

PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2011 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

From Aljazeera live footage:

French and Italian fighter jets are now flying reconnaissance over Libya, and US is supplying target intel from platforms outside Libyan territory.

French Mirage fighter bombers attacked Gaddafi armored vehicles which were attacking Benghazi; and the tanks are now withdrawing.

Shootdown of one Libyan fighter jet, flown by a revolutionary, shot down by pro-Gaddafi forces - pilot ejected too close to the ground and was killed.

Report:
51 KIA and 83 WIA yesterday in the revolutionary ranks.

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